Are SL5x5 and Starting Strength just a fucking meme...

So wtf do I use? I was on Alpha Destinys novice program but in continuously stalling. Thinking about PH3. Also I’ve been doing Gomad.

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You have no business doing SS or SL

At some point you'll have to make your own routine. What works for some won't work for others. You need research and trial and error. All pro bodybuilders, powerlifters, etc. follow their own routines.

Thats what I figured. Should I just build something myself? Trial and error is a bitch.

What are your goals?

Do greyskull and quit GOMAD
tigerdroppings.com/rant/health-fitness/the-greyskull-methods--a-primer/70504728/

What I love about greyskull is that deloading and building back up isn't such a soul destroying process, as you can still challenge your self (greyskull uses amrap sets as last set, so when you deload back to 40kg on OHP, you can aim to beat the amount of reps you had last time you were at 40)

*cough* make a greyskull variation

This
You will have to experiment, but the universal truth is the more volume you can do the more progress you will make. As long as you can recover from it.

WS4SB

Also, GOMAD is retarded if you want to look good

I want to obviously remain impressive looking but my primary goals are raw strength. Lets say a 4pl bench, 5 pl squat, 6 pl dead, and 2pl overhead for arguments sake

Juggernaut Method
5/3/1
Madcow

You have options

I’m checking out the Westside method rn. It’s a tossup between Greyskull, PH3 and looking at Westside. I’m dedicating the next months to this so I want to be sure..

Joe Defranco's Westside for Skinny Bastards

The actual Westside is high specific for geared, roiding powerlifters

True, but I want size and strength rn. I put on 5 lbs in 2 weeks on Gomad.

Greyskull and Westside are both more like methodologies rather than set-in-stone programmes. Maybe just take some key principles from each and work something out for your self.

N-suns 531 is best intermediate program, just make sure you set the t2's to your specific weaknesses, and make sure you do some kind of back exercises everyday

They are not a meme. It's intended to be used for about 6 months of progress before moving onto another program like the texas method.

4 day split programs that wave intensity are also good.

But yes starting strength was only ever intended for complete beginners but it does do a good job of getting people stronger and with hard work you can reach 1/2/3/4 for reps using it.

I'd say most people don't because they don't do then program, they don't eat enough and they don't sleep enough. But even so if you do SS for the first 6 months and then texas method after and still don't reach 1/2/3/4 for reps you should just kill yourself.

Greyskull workload is too small. I’m going to be in the gym 30 mins max for 3 exercises..

Any program that forces you to do "their exercises" is a meme. Exercises are not one-size-fits-all and there are people who will get injured doing low bar squats as well as conventional deadlifts.

Stop egolifting

Add more volume then silly
as stated it's not set in stone and you are encouraged to adjust it so it works for you
you're even recommended to do submaximal bodyweight work throughout the day 6-7 days a week

The sole purpose of SS is to a) teach you how to perform the big compound lifts, b) pack stupid amounts of raw mass on your underweight twink skeletor body. And then you have SL, a rip off made by a snake oil salesman who will tell you that squats will make your arms grow.
The problem with SS/SL is that they are simply not indended for most people who try to run them. So you end up with hundreds of fat/skinnyfat noobs who tried to run it on deficit and crashed two months in, or went full tyrannosaur mode and now can't fit in to their skinny jeans.

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>Just a fucking meme?
I'm sick of this question. It has no descriptive power. All things are memes. It means nothing about whether starting strength is
>Optimal
>Efficient
>Safe
>Decent
>Effective at all
Or whatever. Ask real queations like an adult and get real answers.

Starting strength is fine for a few months if you value strength over aesthetics. But it would be safer and better with an extra set on presses and a lot more core isolation. Do not take mark rippetoe's diet advice. Nor his intermediate programming advice. The best takeaway from his books is really the description of technique.

THANKS FOR THE MILK, MARK

>SL

If you want to look like Mehdi, do a program by Mehdi. Most people don't because the dude doesn't look very impressive despite lifting for years, yet he swears up and down these are the only lifts you need. But he also has a section about adding accessories "if you must".

So read between the lines, something is wrong here and maybe you *should* do accessories. To that end, SL was useful for me. It teaches a complete novice who has never lifted how to start lifting barbells, then it's up to you do decide if his "dude just do only these for forever" position is retarded (it is). Like most things in life, SL isn't perfect but it's not worthless for its purpose.

If SS is like not aesthetic enough what's a good aesthetic program? Or is SS fine to start with and then worry about looks later

tigerdroppings.com/rant/health-fitness/the-greyskull-methods--a-primer/70504728/

I'd check out /plg/ to see if they have any advice on specific routines. But I also don't browse those threads and they could be cancerous, IDK.

From the looks of it, you want some sort of intermediate program like texas method or 5/3/1

Pulling deficit can be countered by superseting rows with the T2 lift of the upper days.

/plg/ is currently "advertising" PH3.

>GOMAD is retarded if you want to look good
GOMAD will make you look good if you're applying it properly. It's not for everyone, it's for the 110lb Auschwitz mode skelly who barely eats 1000 calories a day. A month of GOMAD will make someone like that look 100% better.

>full tyrannosaur mode and now can't fit in to their skinny jeans
Literally me.

THANKS FOR THE MILK, MARK

i am 6'3" 150lbs eat tons of food like once or twice per day, but i cant gain weight or mass and i have problems with motivation because my autistic tick is computer science - how do i get Jow Forums?

Eat more and lift heavy things

Hard mode: weigh and count the calories in everything you eat. No estimations allowed, if you can't weight it or scan the barcode, you don't eat it. Keep a meticulous food diary, weigh yourself every morning and increase your caloric intake until you find an amount that lets you steadily gain weight.
Easy mode: drink a gallon of whole milk every day.

>6'3" 150lbs
>eat tons of food
No you don't. Count your fucking calories.

I go out to eat every day - what if I can't cook and don't know the calories of the meals at restaurants? Not a denialfag, I can accept that maybe I don't eat as much as I think I do, but in that case not sure how fix - I eat until stuffed like 1-2 times per day.

Usually chipotle and so-on. And I milk it - bowl, double meat, tortilla on the side, and usually a bagel or something else right after.

>maybe I don't eat as much as I think I do,
There's no maybe, you 100% do not eat a lot.

Do you have tips? What can I do in my situation? Any quick-win foods?
>cant cook - will burn house down making ramen
>make decent money
>low-effort, motivation problems
>need to roll it into my autistic routine somehow

Not him, but work out how many calories you need to eat in a day (a good way to bulk is BWx12+1500)

If you want low effort, then buy a blender.

Blend oats, peanut butter, whey, and milk.
Easy way to get over 1000 calories in one meal.
Chuck in some banana for vitamins.

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Eat a loaf of bread and 2 litres of milk in one go
Costs like $5
>ugh but that’s such boring food
Shut the fuck up

>Any quick-win foods?
Bulk shake, pic related. Blend it all up with some ice and enjoy.
>>cant cook - will burn house down making ramen
Learn how. I don't have the link, but there's an imgur album full of easy Jow Forums recipes.
>>low-effort, motivation problems
That's something you have to work through yourself. I often have trouble motivating myself, it really is just deciding to do something and following through. Make goals and go for them, maybe even talk to a counselor or (((therapist))).

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READ THE FUCKING STICKY

user, it occurs to me i have most of these things.
how many times should i do this per day in general? 150lbsx12+1500=3300 calories so twice per day plus a restaurant meal or something?

>see roman god-man
>monkey brain want be like this
>immediately associate truth with post
fuck you're right. i have to change

holy shit a thread that is actually useful

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Yeah, use myfitnesspal or something to work out how many calories are in your shake, then go from there (you'll get the most calories from the peanut butter, 140g is 800 calories; buy 2kg a week and you'll be good)

Make sure to eat your veggies too

thank you anons. i will do these things

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If you make a 1000kcal shake, drink at a medium pace. If you go too slow it will be hard to finish, but if you pound it at your size you might puke.
Good luck, user. We're all gonna make it.

Well, I've been doing SS for 4 weeks now. Should I continue it for like 4-5months to get some base muscle and then switch off to something else?

>yeah bro, i could totally 1/2/3/4 for reps after my first week in the gym, i dont need ss/sl shit lmao
>sorry bro, i lift for AESTHETICS, i dont wanna be a bloatlord like you, lmao
God, this board is so shitty. I can envision all of you doing stupid sitting incline dumbbell overhead press and EZ bar triceps extensions with 1/1000 of an inch ROM just like all the other normalfaggots at the gym and then checking out your abz and gunz in the mirror on your way out. Pathetic.

Do it for 3 months then move on to an intermediate program

I would agree, except the oats. They're always a giant pain to clean out of the blender in my experience.

>SL is snake oil
Damn, really? I've been running it a few weeks and like how easy It is to do consistently with the free app.

I guess I could just buy the app and customize something better if the program really is that shitty.

It was fine for me for 6 months, make sure to add accessories so your upper body isn't shit.

Suggested accessories?
I'm pretty sure my rowing form is fucked up and I don't want to fuck myself up. Tips?

Also, can I substitute OHP with The Press?

rate my beginner routine

xxAxBxA
A
squat 5x5

B
deadlift 1x5

alternate/per session
bench/ohp 5x5
seated cable row/lat pull down 3x8-12
pull-up/dip 3x
tricep extensions/ez-curls 3x8-12
knee raises superset with sidebends

>Suggested accessories?
Curls, bench on non-bench days, whatever your favorite tricep accessories are.
>I'm pretty sure my rowing form is fucked up and I don't want to fuck myself up. Tips?
My rowing form has never been good enough for me to feel comfortable giving tips.
>Also, can I substitute OHP with The Press?
No.

Why would you do SL over SS?
SL:
>shit volume
>shit variety
>creator is a DYEL random on the internet
SS:
>better volume
>better variety (the actual routine, not the bastardized stage 1 only routine)
>creator is a strongfat strength coach with years of experience

Just do the Reddit PPL.