Rust shills next level
>vice
honestly I hate everything about this meme language
I wish there was real alternative to chrome and Firefox.
I wish i could dump ff
>chromium is pure botnet
>you cant conpile a modern ff without that retatded language
> Firefox
> the only company using it
> memory leaks
Sure blame c++
The World Has a Huge Table Saw Problem And Carpenters Don't Want to Deal With It
they should also use Rust OS
most big tech hates c/c++ and is trying to ditch it
> is
Your opinion is valid.
Website backends are written in ultra high level languages and get compromised all the time. The language is irrelevant, it's the competence of the programmer. That, and there's a lot of components in your computer that need firmware and drivers. Your PC is only as safe as the weakest link.
I'm not an experienced C/C++ programmer but it's probably the same as with Java.
People who're too stupid for Java (Yes, there are really people too stupid for Java) try shilling new memes like Kotlin. Yeah sure, Java has its hiccups but it has improved a lot since Java 8 and those small hiccups are not a reason to replace a language that has proven to work for over two decades and it's probably the same with C/C++
Rust enforces memory safety at compile time or forces you to declare explicitly unsafe blocks. Mozilla basically created it to stop memory issues with Firefox.
RustPython when?
Redox is pretty neat. My ideal desktop OS would somehow merge Redox, Haiku, and magically flawless driver support for everything I own.
hopefully never
fuck ___dynamic_typing___
>vice
>article paid by mozilla to advertise rust
lel
I'd be more interested in Rusty Ruby 3 with parallelism.
>memory safety
Correct me if I'm wrong but what would be the point of C/C++ if they weren't memory-unsafe?
The idea is that compile time checking doesn't have GC pauses and so you can use Rust in kernels or browser engines where GC overhead is unacceptable. This isn't universally true yet because the language and compiler toolchain are nowhere near as mature as GCC or Clang (although it does use LLVM so at least the backend is solid) so performance isn't on par with C or C++.
In my experience rustc is really autistic with its checks but I've only used it for about two weeks. If we remove unsafe blocks from Rust, is it less expressive than C++? ie. Is there valid code that you can guarantee is safe (via reasoning) in C++ that can't be expressed in Rust without use of unsafe blocks?
>C++ and C are insecure, use this memory safe language instead!
>80% of the standard library uses unsafe code
kek
It's true. A ton of bugs and complexity would be avoided if all Cniles died tomorrow (and carried UNIX with them). Use Ada, Lisp.
Yes, tons such code, which is the biggest problem bar none in rust. It means you end up invariably programming yourself into a corner, where your only choices are: rewrite the whole thing to add a new feature, or use an unsafe block to implement it.
But the features that rust provide are much higher-level than C++ and these features are really welcome. If it weren't for the borrow checker, it would be a really good language. But without the borrow checker, it would have to use gc and then it would suck ass.
>Vice
Fake news.
Imagine being this retarded to not understand unsafe
Correlates with software requiring more and more for less and less alright.
>the intent is that as the programmer, you’ll ensure the code inside an unsafe block will access memory in a valid way.
So the exact same responsibility I have writing C++ already. Phenomenal.
If people developed in Haskell this wouldn't be a problem. Functional programming is simple programming and simple programming is safe programming
What's the desktop environment like?
Does redox actually try to advance OS design, or is it another clone of 80s era Unix shit?
Honestly my favorite thing about Rust is cargo. I wish C++ had something even remotely as good but it's too old of a dinosaur to fix in this regard.
Modern C++ avoids a lot of these issues with RAII and robust STL containers. Why would you re-orient your development to a language like Rust when you can just migrate your C++ code-base to modern C++?
yes, but with a dramatically smaller audit surface
I don't care how much Jow Forums hates on it, I like Rust. It's a decent, modern alternative to C++. Now if we can find a modern alternative C, I'd be happy. I hear people shill Crystal, Nim and Kotlin a lot.
C doesn't need a modern alternative. You can just use Rust if you really don't want to bother with C.
for (i = 7; i >= 0; i--) {
/* shit */
}
What did they mean by this
>Firefox
>Memory leaks
By this, what was meant?
That's a good argument for large, mature codebases, where the cost of migrating to an entirely different language will be astronomical - but so will be updating the code to those newer practices. The real reason to not use rust in production for new software projects is a lack of library support and tooling. I haven't kept up with rust's development over the last couple years, so I don't know how valid those reasons are now, but I'd imagine it's relatively the same.
There are a crap load of libraries. It's gotten popult for some reason. I would have preferred if it was Ada. However, rust found a way to appeal to cniles in a way no other replacement has.
>C/C++ are memory-unsafe
>Create a new memory-safe language
>Depend on compiler to catch memory errors
>Use LLVM (written in C++) as compiler backend
>Magically believe Rust is memory-safe
Fucking trannies, how can anyone be this stupid?
But firefox still has huge memory leaks so that was pointless
The problem isn't the programming languages. It's the numales, klossy koderz, and pajeets who can't wrap their pea sized brains around anything that runs outside of an interpreter. These dumb cunts need everything to be bubble wrapped and extra safe because they don't understand what it means to optimize and test a piece of software.
Once compilation hits the back-end you're pretty much in the clear for language constraints other than potential use of inline ASM. There's no downside to using LLVM. It's not like a leak in LLVM is going to cause bad code generation.
a backwards for loop from 7 to 0 inclusive
>There's no downside to using LLVM
There is if you don't trust C++
>It's not like a leak in LLVM is going to cause bad code generation
Memory corruption can cause undefined behavior during code generation, it happened in a release version of Delphi at my first programming job. The idea of Rust is to create a memory-safe language, and yet it depends on a massive C++ codebase to do something as simple as generate code. LLVM is neat for what it is, but if predictability is a primary concern then writing your own code generator is one of the easier parts of compiler design, so why get lazy about it? It seems asinine to throw a fit about the insanity of a language and then cram that same language into your own compiler.
>applel is incapable of paying a fucking computer scientist to tell them why the fuck their unicode parsers are such a mess
>apple has a C/C++ problem
I love how obvious this editor's lack of knowledge is.
underrated post
>hating on C and C++ to this level
>even C++
Oh boy. Okay. Why not let's all switch to Python and Javascript now? Now there won't be those scary errors that pop up anymore and we won't get those scary scary bugs! Speed, efficiency, and memory usage doesn't matter. Keep sucking up those 500 mb web pages, everyone!
this is what happens when you fire your real programmers in favor of nodejs diversity hires
javascript is surprisingly performant
Eh. I get pretty annoyed with many of these programmers programming in languages in Python, and especially Javascript. Sure, some of them are probably really great and smart people, but those languages have a tendency to produce dumb coders who have no idea what they are doing. They write shit code with no efficiency in mind and just slap libraries with edgy new hipster shit on and fail to cover a ton of the simplest bugs. It's honestly quite annoying.
Luckily they don't (usually) mingle with your codebase if you're not in the same domain as them. So there's always that. I avoid webdev like the plague.
>thinking a buffer overflow is that simple
What the fuck is wrong with this journalist? Buffer overflows are rarely ever that simple. And if they do exist in some code, a compiler often helps protect it with stuff like a canary. This is some stupid journalistic sensationalism. You will never buffer overflow shit that easily in the wild unless the developer is completely retarded.
Because of engines written in C++
Fair enough, but we build these abstractions for a reason - we want the javascript devs to have an easy time writing performant code because we need a lot of them until we can replace them with robots.
>we want the javascript devs to have an easy time writing performant code because we need a lot of them until we can replace them with robots.
Uhh, you do know that hackers like to target JS engines on windows, right? Bad programming standards and practices are bad, regardless of the language.
Sure, but we should be preventing those issues from happening in the C++ engine and protect Javascript coders from fucking up as much as possible. If that means limiting their ability to express some concepts that's fine. The people that are able to reason about these vulnerabilities (C++ programmers) should be the ones handling them.
*laughs in Python*
Too brainlets for Haskell. And we need a more sophisticated compiler.
>vice
>Sure, but we should be preventing those issues from happening in the C++ engine and protect Javascript coders from fucking up as much as possible.
That's what M$ is trying to do, but bugs keep popping up. I don't think this cat and mouse game will ever end, but it can be curtailed. We just need more people with these, for lack of a better word, rare skill in think tanks and special teams.
>If that means limiting their ability to express some concepts that's fine.
Microsoft is a for-profit business, I don't think they would be okay with that.
>wah, wah, don't archive our ridiculous claims before internet users store them forever online
>it's right wing activism if they try to question our journalism, which is definitely not clickbait or just hipster shit
>how dare you call us out on mistakes. You must support Drumpf!
How do these people tweet shit like this without feeling like a retard?
Redox is a "UNIX-like microkernel".
That's not how it works dumbass.
>Alex is a software security engineer at Mozilla, where he works on sandboxing and anti-exploitation for Firefox.
They never stop shilling.
> There's no downside to using LLVM.
Try writing a constant time comparison. ((Hint::YouCant))
>IT'S THE HAMMERS FAULT THE BRIDGE DIDN'T HAVE NAILS!
>waaah me need me hand hold
>don't forget to wear your foam protection suit darling when you walk outside
From what I know, Kotlin adds a lot of shit to deal with the boiler plate in Java, such as automatic lazy evaluation and better handling of null, plus more concise features. So really, it fixes problems intrinsic with the language that makes it very cumbersome.
how tf is someone able to do shit in c (or really any OOP) but not in haskell? it's so much easier to write a function and let the compiler sort things out. Granted, I haven't made any major projects in it, and certainly nothing approaching enterprise-sized, so I don't know how it scales in complexity, but for smaller programs haskell seems infinitely easier, compiler stubbornness or not
Mozilla is starting to hire pajeets to shill the language.
I find it funny that Jow Forums can't decide whether Rust is too easy since it keeps you from writing broken code or too hard because you have to convince it that you're not writing broken code.
>wayback machine
>right-wing
there's no way this garbage is real
If simply archiving what you wrote is enough to be considered an attempt at discrediting you, you probably deserve to be discredited. As or the "chance to update" part, I remember a time when even anime sites an video game forums prided themselves on only updating via edits appended to the end of articles, so you could always see what was originally written.
That's because those anime sites and vidya forums didn't pretend to be news sources
Orange crab bad
>There is only Safari and EDGE left, and both lack something.
People should just make a new browser out of pure webkit.
They could have used a language that have been around 40 years and is way safer (used in planes and stuff), but well...
> Vice
lol
Holy shit lol.
Vivaldi is pretty great, I switched to it last week.
Saw Stop is awesome and should be cheaper/on more saws.
Haskell is great. There's actually some crazy motherfuckers trying to use Haskell to write device drivers for Genode.
C is already relegated to "places C++ can't go" like unix codebases, kernels, and deep embedded for new projects. Rust and Go are eating much of C's userspace duties.
Maybe on Windows. On Linux the process pooling and tab sleeping keeps memory usage fairly flat even over weeks with dozens of tabs.
Ada isn't fast enough with the FOSS toolchains, and IIRC Mozilla wamte
>Now if we can find a modern alternative C, I'd be happy.
I'm surprised at how little interest people seem to have in that. Everyone and their dog wants to replace C++ or Java/C#, but replacing C is seen as either blasphemous or boring.
>Rust and Go are eating much of C's userspace duties.
Sure, but it's kind of questionable why C has those userspace duties in the first place.
lol I thought sepples was suppose to replace C. Go was an attempt to replace C, but I highly doubt it will happen.
V8 based on c++ is faster though the firecucks rusty turd
>lol I thought sepples was suppose to replace C.
Initially it may have been, but they've diverged pretty far in use-case since then.
>Ada isn't fast enough with the FOSS toolchains, and IIRC Mozilla wamte
I'll take "Things I pulled from my ass" for 200
Most of memory leaks in Firefox happened due to 3rd party plugins (Pocket, Flash Player).
>C/C++
This is because we value things like performance.
Do you want your cellphones to run slower and the batteries to run out quicker?
They didn't write this article for sophisticated public. You really think normies want to know all the nuances?
I was taking a shit this morning when I saw this. Not even halfway past the first paragraph I knew this was yet another shill for Rust. Why do people shill Rust so pathetically hard if it was really that good?
You can use c++ for all those things easily. Android has a large collection of c++ code
>Alex Gaynor
>Gaynor
No wonder he's such a faggot.
>There's no downside to using LLVM
The compilation time is horrible
Rust is actually a pretty nice language. It's basically just all the good parts of C++ but with sane default behavior and a handful of neat additions. Also Cargo is great.
Just look past the SJW bullshit.
t. guy who's been professionally coding C++ for 10+ years
>c/c++
This is how you spot a retard.