C#

Why is it so disliked?

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it's not, it's used everywhere. even in vidya, for a reason (hint: it's not performance, it's the way you work with it)

Runs in a vm

The only reason for its existence is because Microsoft wanted their own Java alternative, after the courts blocked them from embracing, extending and extinguishing Java.

whats c#?

And it surpassed Java.

Have you looked at the CLI? It's an absolute mess, and in typical Microsoft fashion can hardly be said to be "meant" to be used directly. It's riddled with ad-hoc mechanisms to support their specific compiler infrastructure and whatnot. By contrast, the JVM is specified in a clean layer of its own, meant to be usable by third parties in an open ecosystem. It's so typical for Microsoft tech to have lower levels that are meant to be opaque and are therefore ill-defined and unsuitable for independent use.

By contrast, the specific C# language only arguably and marginally "surpasses" Java in a few insignificant aspects. Not worth it.

I also forgot to mention how the CLR is absolutely primitive in comparison to Hotspot. It's basically an AoT compiler wrapped in a JIT compiler, and does none of the advanced optimizations that only JIT compilers can do, such as speculative specialization and inlining; the kind of optimizations that can only be done with Hotspot's ability to undo compilation and revert back to interpretation while it recompiles the code in a different manner when certain speculative optimizations turned out to depend on false assumptions.

>llvm
>low level virtual machine
Oh no! How will C-fags ever recover?

I'd just like to interject for a moment. What you're referring to as C#, is in fact, C++++, or as I've recently taken to calling it, a massive fucking travesty. C# is not a programming language unto itself, but rather a retarded Microsoft language extension on top of another language extension on top of the fully functioning ANSI C programming language, made to combat the critical security problems Microsoft’s army of Pahjeets create by limiting their freedoms.

Many programmers write in a modified version of the ANSI C standard every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of ANSI C which is only used by Microsoft is often called "C#", and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the C programming language, standardized by ANSI.

There really is a C#, and these Indians are using it, but it is just a part of Microsoft’s hegemonic retardation. C# is an abomination: a language designed to prevent transparent access to the parts of the system that allocate the machine's resources. The .NET framework is not an essential part of the windows runtime, but useful for cockblocking Pahjeets; it cannot function in the context of a complete programming language. C# is normally used by people and organizations too dumb to figure out pointers in combination with the Windows operating system: the whole language is basically ANSI C with two layers of stupid added, or C++++. All the so-called "C#" programmers are really Microsoft scripters of Indian heritage.

C# doesn't run in a VM, it's compiled to IL for portability, and compiled to native code at runtime.

The language still executes in a virtual environment. Even if the compiler is efficient (though see ), how much memory does it use? I can't speak from personal experience with C#, but I've seen Java programs that are extremely simple in themselves use hundreds of megabytes just because the JVM itself needs that much. I can't say I have enough trust in Microsoft to believe the CLR is significantly better.

It hasn't.

It may be a bit syntactically neater,but .NET and the general ecosystem is trash vs. the JVMs and the Java ecosystem.

Hell, the JVMs even stole .NET's spot as "the thing that can run all these other languages, too", without really focusing on it. It just happend.

Anyhow, the thing to do is to ignore the Microsoft-ecosystem only toy and just use Java or one of the other JVM languages? Want moar syntax power? Scala is better than C# anyhow...

:NET core outperforms Java in just about everything. Admit it. Java is dying.

>Scala is better than C# anyhow...
Is there any alternative JVM language that doesn't require runtime support libraries? I hate shipping 20 MB of extra Jar files just because I wanted to use another language.

lol. See .

I ignored it because you said a whole lot of nothing.

>.NET core outperforms Java in just about everything.
It doesn't.

>Admit it. Java is dying.
The JVM is stronger than ever. Now it's also quite firmly entrenched in big data/big processing and mobile phones apart from still being just as relevant to a lot of bigger websites and the other functions it already filled before.

I don't know how strong Java itself is within the JVM ecosystem in the long run, but the other languages and "killer" frameworks that popped up absolutely fortified the crap out of the ecosystem.

>i've no idea how jit compilers work, the post

Microsoft

Probably not any that you want to use, but you certainly can get well under 20MB of libs. [Most of the JVM languages also have build tools that let you run proguard or comparable on the jars.]

Also, bless your cleanliness, but we're in the age of 40GB video games. If something does an useful job, nobody cares much about even 20MB nowadays.

benchmarksgame-team.pages.debian.net/benchmarksgame/faster/csharp.html
Enjoy your faster Regex.

>If something does an useful job, nobody cares much about even 20MB nowadays.
I absolutely refuse to add a 20 MB superfluous library requirement to a program that is 200 kB in itself. If the library does something that is integral to the function of the program, like a TLS library, then sure, but not just some superfluous programming framework.

Are these tests with precompiled C# binaries vs. JIT-compiled Java? If so, how about a test that isn't more or less instantaneous?

based and red pilled

>.dll files on unix/linux
That's enough reason right there to not use C#.

Because NEETS look at the guys earning money writing C#, Java, and Node.js and they get jealous so they attack the toolset of the employed.

So do you just implement literally EVERYTHING yourself unless you're using 100% of the library's functions? Just so that you can save 20MB RAM? Quick question, are you employed?

I'm perfectly fine with using libraries that can be expected to exist anyway. I've nothing against libc or the standard Java class library.
>Quick question, are you employed?
Self-employed.

the language itself isn't hated - the fact that 99% of the time you're forced to use visual studio (or msbuild) and the .NET runtime to write anything in it is what people hate.

yes mono exists but when you have the option to use it there's almost always a better alternative

As I said, 20MB is not required.

For things that optimize quite a bit for size, it's not much. Example: scala-android.org/ - takes around 30KB to get to a Scala app on Android... obviously without Android having the libs for it. Sure, it'll be more than that the more of Scala's libs you use, but you won't easily get 20MB.

>box full of .so
>i-itz only wrong wen m$ duz it
>why do they call us liars and hypocrites?

Fanboyism at its finest. There is nothing wrong with that.

>embracing, extending and extinguishing Java.
if only

based bill would've made it happen if he was still at the wheel

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I remember that guy from something and it makes me mad...but what was it?

>.NET was engineered in an intelligent way to be faster but it's not fair!
Fuck off buddy.

>spend 30 years of your life learning to operate a complex [machine] with all kinds of levers and switches and instruments
>become extremely efficient at it, everyone who relies on [machine] wants to hire you and are willing to pay grotesquely huge salaries
>somebody invents an automatic version of [machine] that's so simple to use even a Pajeet can do it
>your life skills have been rendered worthless and you're no longer able to even earn a living wage

I wonder why

Nice bait, I'll bite.
>Dotnet core is open source
>Roslyn is open source
>Language spec is open
>Runs cross platform
>You can do unsafe operations like raw memory access
>Real generics, closures, linq, type inference, var, dynamic, func, async, pattern matching, string interpolation, and many more!
>Non nullable types and records coming in 8
>Just werks

Just read the site. Benchmark game is probably the most legit language benchmark.
Those scores are correct. C# vs. Java is basically a crapshoot.

fifth element

if you're working for microsoft its no worse than java i guess. can't imagine using it for your own github project tho lmao just wew

It's 6,000% better that writing shit in node, php, python, basically any shittily typed language.

>le python is bad meme

Embrace, extend, extinguish.
It's not there for your benefit it's to keep control.

C# is the best of the best when it comes to web development, application development and game development.

That shit doesn't work on open source and you know it.