Brexit

Madman strategy. You're all going down

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I don't think they are dumb, In fact they seem very smart. Therefore this decision baffles me even further.

Polish immigrants here aren't that bad.

But it still appears that they are now in a worse situation.

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haha yes there can not possibly be anything wrong with the great EU it is just stupidity to try to resist

>But it still appears that they are now in a worse situation.
Thats just shortsighted.

>i have no arguments, so me use strawman tactics instead

please don't use this thread to insult each other

please elaborate

I agree Brexit gives the capability of freer trade outside the customs union. But why would the EU give the UK free trade? Once it does, other countries will recognise you can have benefits without the drawbacks and jump a sinking ship. In other words, the EU has no incentive to give the UK anywhere close to free trade.

Partly superiority complex, partly anti-immigration but mostly as a protest vote against current conditions. Wages are lower than they were in 2008 in real terms, house prices are ridiculous and there's no supply of affordable housing, unemployment levels are low but that's because job insecurity and shit tier jobs are increasing, a decent education means massive levels of debt etc. Most of these are the fault of the government but none of it would change no matter which party was in power and all of it has happened while being in the EU. That doesn't mean being in the EU is the cause of it but what have you got to lose by voting leave if you're some shelf stacking moron with no prospects anyway? You'll still have the same shit life but at least you have the power to change something now. You don't give a shit if it makes you poorer because you're already poor and have nothing to lose. If voting with the status quo will 100% mean living the same shit life then what's wrong with giving the other option a go?

Basically boomers and chav scum will believe anything they read in the newspapers.

we have a lot of problems and the government shifted the blame onto the EU for years. It's just the culmination of that blame. Lots of people think we'll magically turn around the country after being under the boot of the EU, whilst not understanding our economic programme is entirely of our own making.

EU was supposed to be to keep Germany in a cage but Germany found a way to destroy Europe again

>The British have a chronic case of superiority complex and can't stomach the idea of being nothing more than an equal to the other European powers.
This, tbqhwy.

Being dictated to by the EU = bad
Being dictated to by Moldova (and the US etc) = good

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cringe

Excellent retort

because your wonderful leader was retarded enough to decide on behalf of everyone that millions of undocumented migrants from a foreign culture should be allowed onto the continent resulting in little but soaring crime rates and higher numbers of benefit recipients.

>thinking your ignorant, self righteous rambling deserves anything more

the people needed a common enemy and they fell for it.

this is anecdotal but I personally know leavers who voted because:
-they wanted to spite the government
-they preferred the country when we "owned everything" (even though this has nothing to do with the eu)
-"change is good"
-less immigration
-"we can gain back control"
-we can "go on our own"
-"you don't wanna prop up poland and that"
(things in quotes are taken verbatim)

>but at least you have the power to change something now
Do you believe the EU is a hindrance to changing something? In how far?

I'm not very up to date, but from what I've heard the UK is/will/could suffer(ing) from having less free trade with the EU countries.

Merkel's decisions are retarded, but you already had migrant problems before that. So it can't be just that decision, can it?

quick rundown please

oh thank God! we'll just replace the first world economies of europe right on our doorstep with kenya and maybe even the trade warring americans!

>Why did they do it?
The tl;dr simplified version is probably that most Brits were in favour of joining the EEC because they saw tariff-free trade as nothing but beneficial for the UK, but I think it's also correct to say that most people are wary of how the countries of the EU are becoming more and more politically and economically integrated over time, and that it's a threat to national sovereignty.

A lot of people here just don't like the EU in general though. They think EU politicians lack accountability for their actions, that too many officials are appointed rather than elected, and that the EU in general is something of a German project to secure its own interests in Europe and the rest of the countries (especially the smallest ones and the ones with poor economies) are ensnared into the EU in order to be aligned with German interests.

He's being a brainlet, we had (and used) an opt-out on the migrant scheme meaning we didn't take any in. We take in more non-EU migrants anyway so we've always had control over the biggest aspect of migration

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i can't tell you about people. but for certain politicians didn't stop talking about how we'd have free trade with all the countries in the world, including the EU

We're trying to sign up to some WTO agreement about procurement that would give our companies the ability to bid on projects worth $1.7tn in other countries. We already have access through the EU but other countries now won't let us rejoin unless we give them a lot of concessions and much more favourable terms for them. So shitty countries like Moldova and Ukraine have us by the bollocks because we need a consensus vote to be part of the agreement again.

This is just one agreement regarding government procurement. There's a lot more that cover agriculture, tariffs and trade, IT and a shit ton more. The main argument behind Brexit was to take back control and national sovereignty yet shithole countries can now force us to give them what they want just so we can trade.

Just to add, we have a gutter press so stories like this don't even appear in the news here except for maybe a few lines on page 28. It's far easier to sell papers when you just print soundbites and meaningless slogans.

the exit probably has to do with a lot more feelings than facts, but that's sort of the world we live in now with that kind of shit being the primary driving force for people. Still, it got put to a vote and however sketchy that was, people seem to accept the result and democratic course is following whatever seems to be in their future. Just from what I know, which isn't much as an outsider looking in, there's a lot of dead weight in the EU that basically needs to fuck off back to the developing world they where they belong and then there's the Germans dictating freedom of movement through the EU without any regard to sovereignty or what those people, in those countries have in mind for their own country's make up.

That sort of par for the course I guess when you sign up for the EUbucks, you got to carry some dead weight and take your share of spear chuckers, muslim scum and whatever else crawls out of the busted arsehole of the middle east. Problem for the UK though is they burnt a lot of bridges in the 70's and 80's with their former commonwealth buddies, not a lot of great options for us going to there for work or long term living and they let in a LOT of people since the mid 70s from shitholes like Pakistan, Bangladesh and India which really haven't contributed much to anything in recent civilisation. Its not like Canada, Australia or NZ have done badly since then, but there's still a lingering bit of resentment towards the UK- not a deep hating kind but we felt the door slammed in our faces and we're not exactly sure where we stand with the UK.
They say a lot of shit, but we've all moved on.

Immediate future is probably going to suck a bit, but I think the EU probably has more to lose from them leaving in the long term. Mostly on the money management side of things and as fucked up as the UK is made to seem, they are a stable country which had contributed fairly to the EU, but maybe not gotten much back out of it.

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The real joke is that the EU has (free) trade agreements with pretty much all major trading powers but the USA. Some examples are South-Korea, Japan, AUSNZ and Chile with many more on it's way. I'm really curious what kind of deals Britain can strike better than the EU, probably only a deal with China since the EU isn't very keen on having China destroy the internal market while Britain depends on imports.

The EU would be ok with a Canada style deal, but that is very long to prepare (may take decades) and also conflicts with the Good Friday agreement iirc

Another questionable thing is that by leaving the EU the UK also leaves all trade deals the EU has struck as mentioned in post . Obviously the UK isn't actually looking to stop trade with South-Korea, but South-Korea will have to ensure that even outside of the EU the trade deal still applies to the UK.
This can also mean they get to make some adjustments. So far they haven't said how they will treat the UK after an exit from the common market.

how excactly did the relations with other commonwealth countries go shit in the 70s and 80s? this is new to me

You, they did it because of you Merkel.

It didn't go to shit but Britain before then thought they were actually in charge of those countries while most political ties were cut.

Dumb boomers nostalgic for the old days. They will become firewood after the country collapses.

Systemic issues with the EU, lack of accountability in general, not enough centralisation but also not decentralised enough (it's at this weird phase with "directives").
Also fuck the amount of migrants. Especially Eastern (((Europe))). No more romanians and poles thanks.

The whole post is pretty much incorrect

Do you really think a large percentage of Brexiteers were actually interested in bureaucracy in the EU or problems with accountability?

There are too many stupid EU laws and regulations. There are too many EU immigrants. Joining an EU army would be shit. The EU is a soulless giant beaurocracy. The UK is a soulful constitutional monarchy.

>Do you really think a large percentage of Brexiteers were actually interested in bureaucracy in the EU or problems with accountability?

Or, lets just call each other stupid and racist. That totally won't alienate people more.

Brexiteers want what they read in the papers even if it fucks their lives up

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lmao

jews

No I'm just questioning if your first mentioned causes are actually accurate since in reality most people probably just wanted to feel in power for once more.

It's like saying someone voted for Wilders mainly because of his proposed welfare plans while that's not really a reason anyone ever voted for him, just a bonus on top of the main argument of getting rid of the undesirables.

are there some other stories similiar to this one? only one I heard about was the one about british and french fishers

I've already mentioned the point of Merkel's retarded decision in 2015 I'm not sure if there were any other points as unpleasant as this one

ok, this is based

This pretty much sums it up.

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No, you aren't. You're not even attempting to be sincere in your discussion.
> most people probably just wanted to feel in power for once more
What does that have to do with accountability? There are also many other issues (other than the ones I highlighted).
>Wilders
Nope.

You present the main cause of the Brexiteers to be about the accountability of the EU and problems with their decision making which is just false. Pretending like racist tendencies and general butthurt about the current state of the UK aren't the primary reasons of Brexit is a complete lie.

THis

This

snooty haughty rich soyboy ponce. Kill yourself traitor.

Mostly bilateral movement got shut down between the UK and commonwealth countries, so for a lot of us it meant that visiting, working or just going to the UK (and vis versa) became a lot more convoluted and while it might not seem like much, it did mean that for a lot of us with family over there it felt like the UK didn't really care. Keeping in mind back in the 70s-80s we're talking about roughly 80% of AU, CAN and NZ citizens had direct family connections to the UK.
Its not so much we where 'cut off' completely, but didn't feel nearly as welcome there, which is unusual as travel between AU, CAN and NZ is really easy and still remains very easy.

Then in about 2015 the UK's starting all this shit about how there's going to be increased free trade between Commonwealth advantaged countries and it'll all be fucking great!
What?
The UK is barely a register on our trade exports here and for the most part I don't think the combined trade between AU, CAN and NZ wouldn't be much over 10% and probably much less... so we're kind of wondering if old Dad back in the UK has really lost his fucking shit and is it simply some more bullshit to alleviate their own fears or some kind of fabrication. Its weird, kind of sketchy and no one really knows why

>You present the main cause of the Brexiteers to be about the accountability of the EU and problems with their decision making which is just false
No. I said it was one of the causes of why people want to leave the EU and it's no false. Theres a clear lack of accountability in politics in general. Adding more M(E)Ps to the question just fuddles it more.
>Pretending like racist tendencies and general butthurt about the current state of the UK aren't the primary reasons of Brexit is a complete lie.
Nothing to do with racism, but I even predicted you would call me a racist:
>Or, lets just call each other stupid and racist
See why I don't think you would discuss this in sincerity?
Consider that the EU is a failed project. It can't reign in greece, Italy, eastern (((europe))). What can it do?

>Don't call me racist
>(((Jews))) are behind this by the way

(((doesn't understand memes)))
>jews
>race
pick one.

I fully understand the meme and it's from (((Jow Forums))) so maybe you should go there and admit to yourself perhaps you're just looking for excuses to validate your racism.

Just shut the fuck up you milkyfaced little beta faggot.

>waa waa people don't like the EU so they must be racist!!!!
I don't want to be part of the eu because it has political issues, but I guess that makes me a (((racist)))

> asked by a Germ

Look in the mirror, moron.

t. actual little milkyfaced beta faggot wanting to side behind some right wing issue so he can feel strong for once
I never said that. I'm just pointing out being anti-migration is the main argument of many Brexiteers and they are mainly anti-migration because they don't like immigrants. It's easy to start sperging out for being exposed as the closeted Jow Forumstard you are but it's better to accept the fact and live with it, little virgin freak

thanks, I didn't know about this

at first I actually wanted to make a provocative shitposting thread but then I decided against it, because I do know very little about it and it is simply tiring that almost every active thread here starts with baiting and then turns into insulting each other

Anti-immigration != racist.
What a farce.

Pro-EU queers love nothing more than to pour sanctimonious scorn on anyone who opposes their cuddly flowery BBC leftist world. The most lethargic and NPC way to do this is to see racism in everything.

>immigration
Not wanting to important hundreds of thousands of foreigners makes us racist?
hmmmm
>>>reddit

this in all honestly
when the old people are dead we will rejoin

This man is actually on the EU's payroll
Juncker made him an offer he couldn't refuse (we don't know what yet) to bring the UK out of the EU

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Virgin power hour

>you want to seize national sovereignty back rather than staying in a comfy warm political union? heh- you're beta

Lmao just look at this spastic.

>look Veronica I voted for the tough right wing guy I am a man please stop dating Chad and take me instead!

Real talk: Because they mistakenly believed that brown muslims enter the UK through the EU, rather than through its own former empire.
During and after the referendum a lot of people were talking about all the pakis and muslims that will have to "go back to Germany" or whatever, as if pakistanis come to the UK through Europe.

tl;dr chavs

>projecting this hard.
How long will it take to import your sandnigger families into the Netherlands?

what would the EU gain by making the UK leave?

please stop shitposting in my thread

>seize national sovereignty back
you realise being able to vote and leave was a display of the sovereignty we always had
you sir are an idiot and a moron

>what would the EU gain by making the UK leave?
The EU wanted to form a united federal army, and the UK kept vetoing it. Without the UK, the next time this is proposed it will probably pass.
Although with how Hungary, Poland and Greece are acting up, causing problems just because, you never know.

Brexiteers believe the whole EU vote was like a gigantic battle rather than some old farts throwing a piece of paper into a box.

>thanks, I didn't know about this

The other gut-punch so to speak which I haven't mentioned is the 1973 trade restructure which basically put the end to a lot of trade between UK and the other big 3.
Canada wasn't so bad, they mostly dealt with the US as their primary partner. Aust did ok as we'd begun branching out into Asia, but NZ... well NZ got fucked pretty hard by the 1973 agreement and it took them a long time to get back up on their feet economically as they used to enjoy a fairly privileged access to the UK market.
>(so now they all fucking move here! cunts... j/k we still love NZ)

Reality and proximity also means that the UK sends most of its exports to the European region and if we're talking numbers, the UK sends 5-6x the amount to the Euro's than it does to other commonwealth countries. So when they're talking about a turbo-commonwealth trade thing, I ain't so convinced!

The EU army would be a joke, no EU country has a strong military nowadays

and we would we duplicate NATO, if pretty much all relevant EU countries are members of this alliance

A good neighbor is better than a far friend.

>what would the EU gain by making the UK leave?
? It's one of the best things that happened to the EU in the last 20 years:
>Brexit becomes a total shitshow and nobody wants to leave anymore
>the UK (opposing many EU reforms) is out of the scene
>many important EU institutions move to the mainland
>the financial center of Europe shifts towards the mainland as well
>the EU can start to put pressure on all the other countries with opt-outs in total impunity

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Remainers are soulless materialists

>We must leave the EU because of muh jobs muh economy muh trade deals
>Actually scrap that if you care about material things you are a bad person!

It's more a matter of efficiency and standardization more than anything else
Look up PESCO. The plan is to reduce the number of weapon systems used in the EU so R&D becomes less expensive and interoperability improves

Consider the following:
"Brexiteers" don't want more old farts throwing a piece of paper in a box.
Because we can't be friends with the EU without being part of it?
hmmm

I love how this Europhile is commenting on every not-pro EU reply.

United military means more money efficiency, smaller armies would get access to better bulk deals on uniforms, guns, food; soldiers will get to experience the whole continent on rotations and a "new european man" or whatever the fuck will be bred in the military, exactly the place where he is needed to defend the idea against subversive actions from foreign actors.
European identity demands a european army, if only for the symbolism.

And as for its power, I think you will find that France, Germany and Italy alone can fight Russia if they wanted, and all the other countries only add to that. Russia is the main negative actor right now, with the arabs divided (and so they shall remain) and Turkey unstable as ever, while China is far away and USA is retreating from international engagements with no rival superpower to keep it on its toes.
But again, its worth it even just for the symbolism, so that Europe can be united in more than bureaucracy and pillow safety doctrine.

>Because we can't be friends with the EU without being part of it?
So you first end the friendship and then decide a new one shall be formed on your terms?

>greece hates the eu
>a fifth of its entire economy is european tourists visiting with pockets full of euros

Never fails to make me smile. Greece had such rotten luck, falling for the debt fueled growth meme EXACTLY in time for the financial crisis.

Love the warrior spirit on this Brexiteer beta

Why would I want to stay in a union who’s high court ruled it was hate speech to call Mohamed(pbuh) a pedophile?

>A good neighbor is better than a far friend.

Heck at this point with the world the way it is, having a neighbour you can put up with and them not losing their shit is 'good enough', But especially when it comes to trade and while CAN, NZ and AU aren't the major players in world trade, being able to send stuff somewhere at a lower cost is very appealing. We are lucky though in terms of having close cultural and historical ties with the people and countries we do maintain, it could be much worse.

In that case you should disband the union that is the UK since your own high court ruled that people who propose to have bacon sandwiches to Muslim HR workers should be fired.

Well muslims don’t eat bacon for religious reasons so that makes sense.
They still follow a paedophile.

Churchill was a founding father of the EU, wanted more European integration that almost every remainer, and even wanted Britain and France to become a united country.

You are aware that the UK has more hate speech convictions than the rest of the world combined pretty much?

What the hell is wrong with Ireland?