Is it possible to get abs without cutting?

Is it possible to get abs without cutting?
I don't feel like changing my [spoiler]bad[/spoiler] eating habits, but would still like to get toned.

Do I just need to work harder or is it literally not possible?
I have a flat stomach as is.

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quora.com/How-is-energy-stored-in-muscles
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Yeah but you'll have to tell us your height and weight. I can tell you right now its possible but need to know how big you are

CICO

Do meth

Haven't weighted myself in a while, also don't own a scale.

But, I'm 5'11" and last time I did check, I was like 170-180.

Totally possible. I'm 5'10 and 210lbs. I used to be 170-180 cutting down every pound hoping to see just a 2 pack. Ended up bulking up to 210lbs(not by choice it was an accident) and started lifting heavy. NEVER go over 8 reps. Do ab exercises with with plates(25,35,45) on so you can't go over 8 reps even if you wanted to. You'll have to lift hard. I'm 210 right now and I've got a 2 pack. Meanwhile I was a 180 lb twink who couldn't lift anything eating a fuken salad so I could see a 2 pack under the perfect lighting

Okay, cool. Thanks, user.

Yeah, I don't do much in the way of training for pure fitness. Mostly it just comes from my martial arts training.
But, knowing it's possible will motivate me to stick to that ab routine more.

Cheers.

DNP

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no
/thread

Show us your body babe, it's easier than having to guess

you just got visceral fat pushing your abs to show, that is why you couldnt see shit when you were 180 lb, less visceral fat

No way, dude. That's weird.
Why would you want to see another user's nipples.

Anyone who /thread's themselves is an idiot.
Actually, anyone who does it all is an idiot, really.

Yes, just run for an hour a day on top of your routine. That burns about 500 calories, essentially giving you a deficit and you'll lose fat without changing your diet. But the thing is you'll get hungrier and want to eat more

Nobody cares about your nipples, I'm 99% sure that you are not as lean as you think you are naturally and you will have to cut.
Posting a picture would make it easier to tell you if that's the case but it probably is anyway.

Also read the sticky, it contains everything you need to start out even if some parts are outdated.

Hard to tell you what to do with your body, without you posting a pic.
READ THE FUCKING STICKY.
And no, cutting is in fact the only thing you need to do for visible abs.

It's not natural, I work out, just not specifically fitness' sake. Like I said, it's for my martial arts.

It's literally all high cardio and plyometric training. That's just what martial arts is.

I actually did read over the sticky, and I understand how TDEE works.
I was just wondering if there were other methods and that was a set in stone kind of thing.

I've read that doing suicides, as in, short burst spiriting, is actually a better way to burn calories than just flat out running.

But obviously you can't spirit for as long as you could just run. So, that's why you do suicides.

But yeah, I could easily see that making you hungrier.

Abs are made in the kitchen faggot. You don't beed to restrict calories and what you eat though, restrict time. One meal a day and intermittent fasting. Don't skip on training and cardio. A better alternative is all of the above and keto, but it's not necessary, just easier, once you starve your body of carbs, you stop getting insulin spikes multiple times a day that make you hungry enough to eat a whole cow and then some.

Same as OP but im 6-6'1 amd 170, is it possible? Im guessing same as ?

There's no way this will work.
Staring yourself is not how you get abs.
Fucking up your TDEE will just make your body burn muscle instead of fat for energy.

starving*

All of that is wrong actually.
Starving will work.
And your tdee will go down not because of muscle loss. But because you'll be smaller overall and your NEAT will drop in response to less food.

There is no way that you will ever have abs with that belly fat covering those muscle groups, user.

I don't care how you do it or how much you suffer. If you want abs, you need the skin over your abdominal musculature to be really fucking thin.

Not sure you understand what TDEE is.
Your TDEE is determined by how much you work out every day, not by how much muscle you currently have.

Your body needs a certain of food every day to function correctly. If you don't get it, it will burn your muscle for energy. It's as simple as that.

You're retarded, my dude.
Being fat, and fucking up your TDEE by starving yourself are no where near close to the same thing.

>I don't feel like changing my [spoiler]bad[/spoiler] eating habits

this is why you'll never make it. you can't have your cake and eat it, literally.

I's telling you how it is. You're retarded for not accepting the cold hard facts. Starving yourself is not the only way to lose subcutaneous fat. As I said, I don't care how you do it or how much you suffer. But if you have subcutaneous body fat, you don't have visible abs. Accept it, retard.

Are you literally brain damaged? Is English your native language? Do you even understand what you're saying?

>Starving yourself is not the only way to lose subcutaneous fat.
No fucking shit, retard. That's what I was telling you.

>Your TDEE is determined by how much you work out every day, not by how much muscle you currently have.

No, you fucking retard.
Your TDEE is determined by your overall activity.
And your NEAT burns 5 times more then you ever will in a gym or during any workout. Unless you're a heavily geared athlete.
If your muscle mass was the only thing that mattered 100% when it comes to burning fat then muscle.
A 300lb man with 50% bodyfat will burn just as many calories as a 300lb man with 10% bodyfat.

I have no idea what you people are actually thinking.

>Fucking up your TDEE

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>Your TDEE is determined by your overall activity.
That's what it says in the line you're quoting you fucking retard.

Ok, you're retarded

>durrr no u
>not addressing how you are parroting back what people say to you

>Your TDEE is determined by how much you work out every day, not by how much muscle you currently have.

Overall activity means everything you do in a day including sitting standing walking sleeping etc.
Do you understand?
It's not just about working out.

Lastly, it's about muscle mass. You will lose muscle mass if you lose weight. Period.
Your body will not need the excess muscle to help move you around as you drop weight and you won't have the estrogen that the fat produces that will help spare muscle no matter what you do.

Fasting will not eat up any excess muscle until you're in the normal range of bodyfat or have relatively low bodyfat.
But the body will start pumping out GH to help maintain muscle.
That's how it is.

>Overall activity means everything you do in a day including sitting standing walking sleeping etc.
How do you not consider that working out? All activity short of sitting on your ass is a type of work out.

>Fasting will not eat up any excess muscle until you're in the normal range of bodyfat or have relatively low bodyfat.
That's where you're wrong. That's LITERALLY the whole point of TDEE.

Muscle contains more energy than fat. If you are starving yourself, your body will eat muscle because it's more effective than burning fat. Literally, read the sticky.

How do you accidentally bulk 40 pounds? Thats like, a year of shitty eating.

>How do you not consider that working out? All activity short of sitting on your ass is a type of work out.
Sitting on your ass burns calories.
Thinking burns calories, a surprising amount actually. All of those are your TDEE.
Not just working out.
Working out burns fuck and all unless you're geared up as fuck or do nothign else outside of exercise. Even then you'd burn more calories just by walking.
Anyway, your understanding of tdee is flawed and you think only exercise burns calories.
That's why people fucking fail to lose and keep off weight. They think that they can just burn it off in the gym or from a run or what have you.

>>Fasting will not eat up any excess muscle until you're in the normal range of bodyfat or have relatively low bodyfat.
>That's where you're wrong. That's LITERALLY the whole point of TDEE.
No, you fucking idiot.
CICO is not 100% correct and we are not perfect calorie burning machines.
That only works in a general sense. You understand the basics, but you don't fully comprehend the complexity that can make the basics wrong.

>Muscle contains more energy than fat. If you are starving yourself, your body will eat muscle because it's more effective than burning fat. Literally, read the sticky.
Your body will eat what it needs. Not the muscle. The muscle does not contain fucking energy. It east the muscle because it needs nitrorgen not because it needs energy.
It will take from your body what it needs to survive. And if it needs the stored nutrients in fat? It will break down and consume the fat.

> I bulked fourty pounds as an accident

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> There is no way that you will ever have abs with that belly fat covering those muscle groups, user.

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As proven by the picture.

You see a strong guy with a strong core. Girls only see some fat fuck.

>The muscle does not contain fucking energy
Okay, I'm done. Between you're blatant ignorance and sheer got awful retarded levels of English, making stupid typos every other sentence, you're clearly just not worth talking to.

For your own education, this person explains the exact chemical process that happens when your body burns muscle for energy as opposed to fat.

quora.com/How-is-energy-stored-in-muscles

You mean how the body stores energy IN the muscles?

You realize that you're saying that the body will eat an empty cake box because it had at one point cake in it before it will eat the pizza that is laying next too it.

Yes, just like energy is stored IN fat. That's how cells work, you store things IN them.

Fucking retard.

>You realize that you're saying that the body will eat an empty cake box because it had at one point cake in it before it will eat the pizza that is laying next too it.
This makes no sense and in no way relates to anything that's been said. What the fuck are you talking about.

Abs are made in the kitchen. You need to cut fat AND build your ab muscles. Or you can just try getting fuckhuge and hope your abs get powerful enough to push the fat out of the way

The glucose in the muscle is not the muscle.

You're a fucking retard.

> maintain eating habits
> swim 2 hours in a cold pool
> do 15 min ab workout daily

Depends on your baseline. If you're a twink with low bodyfat, you can lean bulk and get abs. People often spout "abs are made in the kitchen" but that isn't completely true. A skinny dude with no muscle definition won't have a six pack because the abdominal muscles are too small. The stronger the abs, the more belly fat there can be with them poking through.

So the long and short of it is to train your fucking core. Compounds alone are not enough. Do planks, front levers, hanging leg raises, whatever.

Are you actually stating that the energy stored in the muscle is the actual muscle?
Is that what you're fucking telling me?

I should have known that you didn't know what the fuck you were talking about when I heard you blather on about fucking TDEE without fully understanding it.

Keto is about replacing carbs with fat, which means your body starts burning ketones instead of glucose, it's not starving yourelf, it's controlling your hunger. No carbs means no insulin spikes, meaning less hunger.

See Like, between the links in this thread and the sticky, you have multiple citations proving you wrong, and you still just go "nuuuh uuh my word is fact!". With broken English no less.

Ugh
Energy stored in muscle Is the muscle. Muscle fibers are made from proteins. The proteins contain high energy bonds. As the body breaks down proteins, the energy stored in those bonds is released (different parts of amino acids actually get shunted off into metabolic pathways) by converting it all to ATP.
So yes, the muscles are the energy.
Learn some fucking basic biochem because you're both arguing the same point but you both don't have the basic concepts down

this whole thread is shit
op, how about you stop being a piece of shit and actually read the sticky. the info youre looking for is in there. this whole thread of full of fucking morons except for the one guy who said that you cant have your cake and eat it too or some shit.
tldr; not possible, stop being a lazy piece of shit, hit the gym, or just kill yourself

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>you're both arguing the same point
No, we're really not.
This retard things that what makes up the muscle, as in, which is what's inside the muscle cell, isn't actually the muscle.

He thinks muscle cells are like a container or some shit.

I like how you talk about being lazy, but you didn't even read the thread, because the OP said how he already works out.

YA GOT ME. FUCK.

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What fucking citations do you have that states that fucking glucose and the energy stored in muscle is the actual muscle.

MUSCLE STORES ENERGY YOU STUPID BITCH!
A GAS CAN IS NOT GAS!

PROTEIN IS NOT ENERGY! IT CAN BE USED AS ENERGY BUT THE BODY DOES IT AS A LAST RESORT!
FAT IS ENERGY!
CARBS ARE ENERGY!
THE BODY DOES NOT USE MUSCLE AS ENERGY! IT USES IT FOR THE AMINO ACIDS THAT IT NEEDS TO SURVIVE!
ARE YOU PEOPLE FUCKING RETARDED!

Your muscles don't metabolize protein for energy, retard. This is dunning kruger effect: the post.

Intermittent fasting
You're just cutting without realizing it

Mass = energy. There, you're wrong.

only by strength training you cannot reach caloric levels you need to cut but if you incorporate some decent endurance training too it is possible

>strength training (to maintain muscle)
>endurance training (to burn calories)
>enough protein (to be able to maintain muscle while on a cut - which is not insanely much)

So what's happening when muscles atrophy? If the body can metabolize its own fat why won't it metabolize its own muscle?

And you know what else?
If muscle was energy and so fucking fantastic that the body would metabolize that before/instead of fat then rabbit starvation wouldn't be a thing.

You do realize that you don't have a set number of muscle cells, correct? Your body makes and destroys them constantly, literally every day.

And yes, protein is a form of energy, and no, it's not used as a last resort, it's used when you body thinks it needs it. e.g. when you are starving yourself.

Google search "when your body burns muscle instead of fat".

Please, just shut up already.

gluconeogenesis occurs in the liver, retard

Just because the body metabolizes the muscle doesn't mean that it uses it for energy.
The body gets rid of what it doesn't need.
It gets rid of things that gum up the works and makes life tough.
If you are a fat as fat ass but are otherwise surviving and even thriving at the moment then you'll remain the same till you create a situation where it is disadvantageous. And it adapts.
That is what exercise is.
An directed manipulation of these very important survival mechanisms to achieve a desired physical state.

>the body would metabolize that before/instead
Why do you keep repeating things that have already been addressed.

The body burns muscle ONLY if your TDEE is not met. It doesn't go straight to burning muscle, you fucking retard, no one said this.

Actually yeah. It does have a set number, unless you take some kind of drug or do something drastic.
And just because it's destroyed and replaced doesn't mean anything. That's just how the body is.
That litterally has absolutely nothing to do with anything that we are fucking discussing.

Lastly, you should actually google it yourself. You quite clearly don't understand what's going on.

You're embarrassing yourself and wasting my time.

Your life is one massive joke, you're posting on an English site when you hardly speak and understand English.

Again, there are MULTIPLE citations in this thread and the sticky proving you are wrong. You have ignored them multiple times and just keep screaming that your word is fact.

It will break down the proteins to use those amino acids for other things it needs (like building DNA). I know the body isn't 100% efficient, So you piss out the extra nitrogen.
Okay? And? Does gluconeogenesis provide amines for DNA synthesis? Do you even know how gluconeogenesis works? You're not explaining anything and making yourself look stupider

>gluconeogenesis provide amines for DNA synthesis? Do you even know how gluconeogenesis works
I take this part back. Everything is interconnected, but the point is. Even through gluconeogenesis the body is utilizing the energy stored in those bonds to make sugars.

It will metabolize what it doesn't need. Not all of your muscle.

And the body will burn glucose and whatever is in the blood stream then go directly to fat.
It will not fucking touch your muscle at all until you are fucking very very very low fat and then it will start scavenging for everything in your body no matter if you are giving the muscle enough resistance to tell it that it's needed.

Want to know why?
Estrogen.
The fat produces enough estrogen to protect and spare the muscle and give you enough energy to get from a-b.

It's why women litterally do not have to worry about muscle loss when dieting.
AHAH!! You so.
OHO hold up.
Muscle loss happens, like I said, when you fall to a very low bodyfat when there is not enough dietary protein and enough resistance to maintain it.
Not because it needs energy.

You'll burn all of your muscle off if you don't eat over your tdee, which is random as fuck and never fully correct, is an old gearhead wives tail.
That's all.

But let me let you in on something, a little concession. No matter what you do, no matter how perfectly you eat even on your tdee. If you as a natural do not have enough fat on you, your body will not keep any muscle. It will eat everything. Including muscle.
Take a look at true natural contest bodybuilders. Hell take a look at geared bodybuilders and how their bodies react.

>It will not fucking touch your muscle at all until you are fucking very very very low fat
Your life is one massive joke, you're posting on an English site when you hardly speak and understand English.

Again, there are MULTIPLE citations in this thread and the sticky proving you are wrong. You have ignored them multiple times and just keep screaming that your word is fact.

Show me.
The one fucking quora link and saying JUST GOOGLE IT are not links or citations.
You are both wrong and stupid.

>It will break down the proteins to use those amino acids for other things it needs (like building DNA). I know the body isn't 100% efficient, So you piss out the extra nitrogen.

Okay....
I know that. I just said it.
What's your point?
That you can use google/duck duck go/yahoo?

>links and citation are not links citation because i say sooooooo!!!!!!!

Never go over 8 reps? What stupid advice. Work in all rep ranges from 1-20

look up g flux and really high carb very low fat diets and daily training

This.

Kek insane post

>I don't feel like

Stopped reading there, not gonna make it.

So you didn't lift and had no fat and didn't have abs, and now you do lift and have fat and you can only kinda see your abs. HMMMMMM